I’ve had a busy night in a fun sort of way. I did a radio interview with thesource.fm and then chatted with some listeners afterward and then went over to www.stryper.com to hear some samples of their new covers album.
I am listening to the Stryper samples and taking notes as I read comments at the Christian Metal Realm about the “The Top 100 Christian Rock Albums of All Time” list that we printed in the July/August (25th Anniversary) issue. There’ll be a few things i want to comment on, but I want to get thru the entire thread before i comment…
First comment: Think about it…no one is going to love this list. All of us will find something to hate. Nature of a list.
As I Lay Dying should be on the list. A glaring ommission, to be sure; as is Barren Cross. Which AILD would you choose? I prefer An Ocean… but chose Frail Words to be on the list, but in the end it got shoved aside.
U2’s The Joshua Tree… Being on the list at all is the question. If it gets on the list, it deserves #1 spot. I mean 25 million copies. Come on! That is HUGE. Great album. They’re all believers now. It didn’t find them leaving the faith. Anyone who thinks that was misled. The one non-believer in the band has since become one. The band is wearing their faith on their sleeve more than ever now, but each and every song on that album is rich with a biblical worldview. Do I agree with every nuance of the left-leaning “Bullet the Blue Sky?” nope. Still. It’s possibly the best rock album ever.
As far as metal goes, one thing you guys should appreciate is the sheer amount of metal on this list. Most rock critics, I would venture a guess (with that same vitriolic disgust that most of you might share in such a context) would disdain metal and have only a token album here and there of metal. If I made a mistake on this list, it might have been too much metal (when taking a “big picture” perspective of what “rock” is, etc), but in the end, it was my list, so poo on the anti-metal critics that would rather have more indie rock on there. haha
For this list, there was massive consultation done. So the promotion of rioting is just irresponsible. hehe. Seriously, I got some consultation from some people in the know – both older guys in touch with Christian rock’s history and newer, younger guys that love to get in the pit. Then I decided from my own 25 years of experience (if doing this magazine for 25 years gives me any benefits – it’s getting to do this list) I made the choices and rankings. A thankless job. If a committee had been used to make this list, would it make the glaring mistakes any easier to stomach? I think not.
There will be a Top 100 Christian Metal Albums of All Time list in the pages of Heaven’s Metal Fanzine. This one was decided and ranked by committee. Believe me, the lone ranger approach is way less hectic. All the fighting, etc. It was harsh. I’m in disagreement with a lot of picks on that one. It’ll be interesting to see how it shakes out. But the reality is: if any of you compile a list, you’ll find very few people that agree on every pick.
The guy who has nothing to do with HM because of the Ultimatum review is just being a punk. You’re like the old Baptist lady that boycotts some product because they advertised on a tv show that offended you. Get over it. If you’re mad, be mad. Be furious. But don’t boycott something good because of a mistake. (Yes, I am referencing HM Magazine as being “something good.” Granted, I’m biased, but if I were not involved, I would still probably appreciate a magazine that covered the music scene I love. I hope so.)
I’m sorry we printed that Ultimatum review. I honestly thought dude was a good fit for the album prior to the review. It came in close to deadline with not a lot of time to deliberate. I probably should’ve pressed for a re-write. I failed. I’m sorry. Will you forgive me?
My mistake, though, it should be noted, was in the favor of journalistic integrity and freedom. Dude doesn’t have to like any album. I thought he would. He gets metal. But he sure didn’t get this album. Scott Waters’ voice is an acquired taste, like many great metal vocalists, so it shouldn’t be a total shock that someone apparently hated it. His review stepped over the line. Boycotting HM (even a personal boycott) is plain vengeful and stupid in my own (stupid, dumb, big fat idiot) opinion. 1 dumb review out of 32+ in that issue, almost 180 or 6 issues ago…
About the comment on mewithoutYou/Larry Norman…
You are insane! I’ve “lost all credibility!?” How ridiculous! Funny. You absolutely have a right to say that, but man. What a strong opinion!
White Heart: eh… They were considered seriously for this list, but fell short of 100.
Rick Elias and the Confessions – that first album was almost guaranteed a spot on the list. I agree it could be top ten. Easy. But it got pushed out. Tough c,uts are made. I feel like a football coach with only 53 roster spots. Some good talented players get let go. It hurts.
Get out of here with the Cindy Morgan comment! Cindy is ccm, along with Amy Grant. Those that have listened to her post-Myrrh albums, though, will know that Cindy Morgan is a great songwriter and almost credible enough to be “legit” in a non-ccm/pop way. In fact, she is. I wish you would have said “Amy” instead, cuz those last 3-4 C.Morgan albums are artistic releases. But the only rule I had, pretty much, was NO CCM! What I mean is “no pop.” Rock has an aesthetic that pop does not. Pop is plastic. Rock is steel. Rock is real. Pop is…artificial.
FF5’s Dance or Die album. Ya gotta hear it and understand crunk and such to get that one.
Owl City is pretty darn poppy, but it has that Joy Electric aesthetic that makes it legit, as opposed to Disney channel schlock…
Dale Mc, ya gotta have an open mind on a “Rock” list. It’s not as narrow as “Metal.” In fact, by my standard, it’s a huge, wide swath. Thus the disagreement over the picks. Seabird is just cool piano rock. Might sound like an oxymoron, but they’re great. Just saw ’em again last night.
I almost didn’t put dcTalk’s JF on the list, but the historical impact of that one was huge.
The criteria, pi_3.14 are spelled out in the magazine. It’s a big long intro. Check it out.
You know what would have been a great Keaggy album to put on the list (and one of the only live albums to make it?) was “How the West Was One” the 3-disc live album with 2nd Chapter of Acts. Read the sidebar. It has “Strong Tower” from “Find Me in These Fields,” a most excellent album.
(I’m noticing a flaw in a lot of the criticism here…you have not read the issue. you’re going by someone’s post, like a shared music file, rather than what I wrote)
You see, the anger (and some would say hatred) is really not all that appropriate, because we both have an appreciation for great music. Keaggy is a master musician. We are smart to know this. Seriously. We have a lot more in common than we do in disagreement. It’s just this list that has us fighting. And that’s okay, as long as we remember to keep it in perspective. As soon as I think you’re an idiot for not getting this pick and you think I’m an idiot for making that one, then we’re getting out of hand, probably sinning, and just not being cool.
Most all of the complaints, I bet, are about albums that were definitely on my radar. I spent the last 4 to 5 months with 500 to 600 albums (cds, vinyl, some cassettes), pouring over these choices. I dearly wish Saint’s Times End and Too Late For Living, my friend, had made the list, but these ears think those releases don’t stand up as well over the years as I’d hoped (or remembered). It’s just an opinion. Obviously, my opinion is wrong. I’m stupid. But in the long run, we all love the same music, the same bands, just (obviously) to differing degrees. You make your list. Now trim it to 100. Not easy, is it?
See what I mean?
Criticize me. Let’s fight. I’m into this. But just remember that no one single person’s opinion is sacred. And I’m talking about you.
(and you, of course, will talk about my opinion. And we’re both right).
Pantera: read the mag! The list is a “Rock Albums…” list. Not hard rock. Not metal. Yes, it has a slant/favoritism towards hard rock/metal (and us metal fans can rejoice to a minute degree over that tiny little factor), but it’s a rock list. Thus, Jesus Freak belongs on it.
Strangerhoncho: Thanks for the venom. Maybe you don’t hate me. I’ll assume not. I won’t take it personal. But, if you were to graciously instruct me on how to regain credibility (come on, it’s GOT to be possible to regain credibility. it’s just journalism), how would I do so? What could I do to make HM more credible? What were my major mistakes? How can I learn from them? What would be better? I am not being sarcastic here. Your feedback could seriously help me out. I’m listening. Feel free to take it private (and send me an email) or keep it public. I am pretty sure I can benefit from your insight. I hope so.
Another post about the methodology.
I answered it prior, but will say again that I compiled the list myself, using my head, my heart, my ears (constantly listening to people on message boards, facebook, twitter, friends and then some industry professionals who know this stuff well). I consulted with others and then made my own choices (and then went back and did more of the same, tweaking choices and rankings up until the very end). This probably sounds terribly pompous to say, but: I earned it by doing this mag for 25 years. Don’t you think? I wasn’t about to open it up to popular votes, etc. It was too important to me to let it get “stolen” by a band and their rabid fans. I’ve seen THAT happen in HM readers polls over the years and it’s just sad.
But think about it. Have you EVER seen a list that you totally agreed with? (and no, the Ten Commandments does not count in this context…or should I say, “…besides the 10 Commandments” ?) I mean, really. I enjoy lists. I never agree with them all. It’s the process that’s rewarding. The fighting. The arguing. The remembering, ‘…oh yeah! This John Mehler album was fantastic!’ or ‘Wow! I forgot how good Pillars of Humanity was!’
Olaf72: Please tell us how to improve Heaven’s Metal fanzine! I want it to have the magic or what you called the “fascination.” Seriously.
By the way, the Heaven’s Metal list got finished prior to the HM list, so don’t go assuming that any changes were made after the first feedback started hitting the fan.
Hey Keven, thanks for bringing up that quote about “…playing this or that album for Steve Harris or some mainstream giant and saying, ‘Here is an example of great Christian metal…'” It changes your perspective in this light, huh? At that point, you wouldn’t play him “Master of the Metal” by Messiah Prophet. I’m sorry. A lot of us liked that song then, but it is not an example of excellence that will impress a musician simply on its musical merits alone.
Okay. I’ve re-read these random replies that I made to address some points on the first four pages of the Top 100 list thread here. I hope these comments are coherent. Let’s keep arguing. It can be productive, fun and edifying … even if we still disagree on such and such album. One of the great observations one can make from this argument process is how much we love our music. It’s cool that it actually matters to us.
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